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Shadwell to Gravesend "zero logistics" trip (June 28th): The Master Plan

Last post Tue, Jul 01 2008, 16:26 by Martin K. 62 replies.
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  •  Thu, Jun 12 2008, 14:44 15318

    Shadwell to Gravesend "zero logistics" trip (June 28th): The Master Plan

    Remember this trip proposal from last December ? With 2 days to go, this is the final organisation thread, which I'll be updating at intervals. Apologies that this is a long posting. On the other hand, this is complicated, so it needs to be !

    What's Involved ?

    All available sea kayaks have been booked for Saturday June 28th, a long Summer's day with special TIDES:

      HW Shadwell:  09:30A 
    LW Gravesend: 14:30A
    HW Shadwell: 21:30A

    The plan is to timeshare boats on a trip from Shadwell to Gravesend and back, as follows:

    • The "AM" team paddle from Shadwell (~08:00) to Gravesend (~14:30) while the "PM" team make the same journey by train. We meet up on the beach at Gravesend (14:00-15:00) for a mini beach-party and lunch stop.
    • The "PM" team then paddle the same boats from Gravesend (~15:00) back to Shadwell (~21:00) while the "AM" team go home by train.
    • Marathoners may elect to go both ways

    Sounds easy doesn't it ? However, this is the first time we have tried something like this, and there is plenty that can go wrong ! Please do help to make it work !

    If you haven't paddled this stretch of river before, here's a brief account of it

    Who's Going ?

    This is a Thames trip, so we operate under the standard River Rules. That means it's basically for 3 stars, but we can take some 2 stars under the "buddy" system, provided the balance is right. Above all, you should be fairly confident of covering the distance (40K) and in reasonable time. If the AM team runs late, this impacts the PM team, and if they in turn are late, they end up returning in the dark and punching tide. If you're not sure whether it's right for you, get some advice from someone who has coached you.

    To register for this trip, you need to reply to this posting indicating :

    • Direction: Whether you want to paddle AM, PM, Either, or Both
    • The Boat: Either Any or OB (own boat) or a named boat if you have a particular preference

    I'll be consolidating replies into the tables at the bottom as they come in.

    We have some juggling to do to sort out boat-shares, so you can ceertainly help by going for Either/Any boat. One way or another, you should end up with a boat-share and a person to swap with at Gravesend. (Negotiate this among yourselves and let me know the outcome of you prefer).

    This trip is not quite symmetrical ! The AM team actually have less time and also have to punch tide initially. Hence, it's probably better if faster paddlers gravitate towards the AM team. But obviously, nobody yet knows what the wind will be doing...

    Booking Boats and Other Kit

    This is a complicated because:
    • Every boat involved needs to be paddled both ways
    • Some people will provide their own boats
    • Basin GRP boats are only bookable by those who have done the intro course

    So although I started a "booking thread", please do not book any boats initially as we will confuse Paul. Just reply to this posting as described above and let the plan take shape. Then we can confirm the bookings with Paul (and you can book any Kit you need).

    All working sea boats (~10) have already been block-booked for this trip, so we should have enough capacity.

    In the unlikely event of a shortage, priority goes to your posting order in the "original thread" followed by this one. FWIW, posting order in the original thread was:

    Dan/Sarah/Gianluca/Sean/David/Pete/Anne?/SusiF/MartinK/h3l3n/Klaudia

    Leaders and Co-ordinators

    This is really just a "long Tuesday night paddle", but we still need to have Trip Leaders in each direction. For the AM team, Chris and Charlie (imminent 4 stars, logging their trips) will be sharing the role. For the PM team, we will have another pair (still to be agreed).

    I'm also looking for volunteers for a Co-ordinator role in each team, someone to stay in touch with their own team members (for early warning of any Latecomers or "No Shows") and to communicate progress to their opposite number (via texts or calls). I'd rather not dump this extra burden on the trip leaders; their job is to get is there.

    No Shows on either leg can seriously mess things up. So if something stops or delays you on the day, please let your coordinator know ! An AM No Show means the paddler waiting at Gravesend doesn't get to paddle. A PM No Show leaves us having to tow an empty boat back.

    Timekeeping

    Historically, we have always had enough time to do this trip in one (6 hour) tide, including some time for break(s). However, the AM team really have to watch the clock and take action if they start slipping behind. To help with judging this, here is an approximate timing plan, imagining 6 hours to do the whole distance at an even pace (ie ignoring the tide curve and not counting stops).

    HH:MM
    00:00 SHADWELL Beach
    00:50 Greenwich
    01:40 Thames Barrier
    02:00 Gallions Reach (possible stop)
    03:30 Erith Deep Water Jetty
    04:00 R.Darenth entrance (possible stop)
    04:30 QE2 Bridge
    06:00 GRAVESEND slipway

    Speed Control, Towing and being Towed

    On Tuesday nights, it has been known for members of a River paddle group (that starts together) to split off and zoom ahead. If you do that during this (40K) trip you will be in breach of the River Rules, and will also be scattering the group and creating co-ordination problems.

    This will be for the Trip Leaders to decide - but in my view, the best way to do this trip is to stay together. In the event that there's one paddler substantially slower than the rest, and we are slipping behind the timings, I suggest we help them along with a double in-line tow, ie 2 faster paddlers at the front helping the slower one along. We have used this arrangement before on Thames trips and it works swimmingly ! Provided the slower paddler is still paddling (ie not actually injured) the trio moves along easily, and the whole group benefits from the equalisation of speeds.

    From the "slow" paddler's point of view, being offered a tow can be a humiliating experience. There's an understandable tendency to resist it and plug on solo, even to the point where the viability of the trip is threatened. If you find yourself being offered a tow, please swallow your pride and let it happen ! The load on your 2 helpers really is quite light, and you owe them no more than a drink at the end. After all, if the roles were reversed, you would do the same for them. Wouldn't you ?

    To cover this possibility, we need people who are comfortable with towlines, so please indicate this in your reply. This kind of towing works best if the towline has a bungee section, to avoid jolting and share the load better.

    If there are any No Shows, we may end up having to tow an empty boat. The Trip Leaders will probably therefore want to pack a cockpit cover to make this easier (empty boats under tow tend to turn over and swamp).

    If any marathoners want to use this trip for pure speed training, I suggest we have a separate discussion about how to accommodate your needs (probably via a separate group, paddling independently but meeting up with us at Gravesend).

    Sharing Kit

    Given the "mirror image" nature of this trip, there are lots of opportunity to share kit (BA, decks, paddles - even day return train tickets!). So before we book anything, I suggest you wait while the "boat shares" take shape - then discuss things with our opposite numbers. That way, you can save carting loads of stuff on the train.

    Aside from that, pack what you would normally take on a Thames day trip, not forgetting food, water, and a sunhat. The PM team should also pack head-torches just in case (though in theory, you will be back before sundown).

    The Consolidated Plan

    (This is the bit I will be regularly updating)

    Individuals Booked

                           DIRECTION            BOAT               BOAT       CAN    LEFT
    WHO AM/PM/EITHER/BOTH PREFERENCE PRIORITY TOW? HANDER?
    Chris (AM leader) AM OB (Aquanaut) ? - . .
    Charlie (AM leader) AM . 0 . .
    Dan AM Preferred Basin Romany 1 . Yes
    Sarah AM Preferred Basin Explorer 2 . .
    Sean AM Nordkapp 4 . .
    TonyR (AM Co-ord) Either OB (KS Viking) - Yes .
    Pete AM Preferred . 6 . .
    JonEeles (PM Co-ord) AM Preferred OB (Point 65N K1S) 12 Yes .
    Ailien (PM leader) Either Aquanaut/WildSys 13 Yes .
    MikeOR AM Preferred OB ? 14 . .
    Liz PM Nordkapp 15 . .
    Cliff PM . 16 . .
    MartinK AM . . Yes .
    JohnS PM . . Yes .

    Finalised Boat Shares

    AM                     PM                       BOAT
    Pete Cliff THCC Aquanaut
    Charlie (AM leader) Dan Basin Romany
    Chris (AM leader) Sarah Basin Explorer
    MikeOR Ailien (PM Leader) OB (DaveT's Orion)
    TonyR (AM Co-ord) JonEeles (PM Co-ord) OB (Tony's Viking)
    Sean Liz THCC Nordkapp
    MartinK JohnS OB (Nick's Romany)

    Checklist For Paddlers

    • Reply to this thread to book your place
    • Monitor the Plan above and negotiate as necessary for a suitable boat, and a boat-share partner.
    • Try the boat out one Tuesday night if you're not sure it's right for you
    • Swap notes with you boat-share partner about any potential kit sharing (paddle, BA, deck...)
    • When resolved, book whatever kit you need between you
    • Monitor this thread for any late changes as the date approaches (eg possible change in the Gravesend rendezvous, depending on wind!)
    • On the day, text your team co-odinator to confirm you're on track for the start.
    • Enjoy it !

    (Blimey, that is a long posting isn't it ? Sorry !)
    TonyR

  •  Fri, Jun 13 2008, 10:54 15328 in reply to 15318

    Re: Shadwell to Gravesend "zero logistics" trip (June 28th): The Master Plan

    Hi Tony ,

    I would  prefer the AM start but either will do.Not sure what boat to use will try a few this Tuesday .

    Pete

  •  Fri, Jun 13 2008, 19:27 15330 in reply to 15318

    Re: Shadwell to Gravesend "zero logistics" trip (June 28th): The Master Plan

    I would like to come along on this trip if possible. I will use my own boat, Point 65 North K1S. I am happy towing and if needed, I don't mind leading or joint leading the PM trip, or acting as co-ordinator. I am also happy to go on the AM trip. I use a right handed paddle, so any left handers getting into my boat will need to bring their own paddle. I don't yet have a boat share partner so anyone interested please get in touch, phone 07831886708 or email me. If you want to try the boat first let me know. I don't need to book any club kit and am happy to share mine, paddle, deck, boat, vhf, pump, towline, etc. The fly in the ointment may be that I am rather low on recognised qualifications, BCU one star. Tony perhaps you could call me to discuss this?
    Jon Eeles
  •  Mon, Jun 16 2008, 7:06 15343 in reply to 15330

    Re: Shadwell to Gravesend "zero logistics" trip (June 28th): The Master Plan

    Hi

    Dan and I would like to do this trip and would prefer morning but I would appreciate it if someone would let me know if my speed is up to this or if I will be too slow.  Dan is left landed and will therefore need a left handed paddle.

    I would like to paddle an explorer and Dan the romany.

    Sarah


    Love many, trust few and always paddle your own canoe
  •  Mon, Jun 16 2008, 12:51 15350 in reply to 15343

    Re: Shadwell to Gravesend "zero logistics" trip (June 28th): The Master Plan

    Sorry. pulling out of this one - going home job hunting around that weekend. Have fun!

    Anne

  •  Mon, Jun 16 2008, 15:50 15353 in reply to 15343

    Re: Shadwell to Gravesend "zero logistics" trip (June 28th): The Master Plan

    Sarah W:

    Dan and I would like to do this trip and would prefer morning but I would appreciate it if someone would let me know if my speed is up to this or if I will be too slow.  Dan is left landed and will therefore need a left handed paddle.
    I would like to paddle an explorer and Dan the romany.

    I've added you to the list as "AM preferred" while you think about it.

    The speed thing is perhaps a bit difficult to judge. We're talking around 9 minutes per kilometer - which is reasonably brisk, but not as fast as the "fast group" often goes on a Tuesday night. You'll have the TIDE with you almost all the way - especially if the leaders seek out the faster water, and cut corners from time to time. The main thing, I think, will be ensuring the group gets away promptly at 08:00, and doesn't take lengthy stops ! Remember there will be lots of time to eat and drink at Gravesend, so probably max 30 mins in breaks on the way down ?

    The wind is the big unknown. The prevailing wind (the one we never get!) favours the AM team - but in the event of a strong Easterly, I will adjust the turnaround time at Gravesend to compensate (give the AM team more, the PM team less). That's something we will know in the last 48 hours - which is why I have asked people to check the thread at the last minute.

    There's also some undeclared contingency (oops ! I'm not supposed to mention that) between the current proposed arrival time at Gravesend (14:00) and the latest departure (around 15:30, start of the flood, with 6 hours till sundown).

    In other words - it's not all super-critical, and we don't need to treat it as a race.

    If in doubt, why not have a tryout on the river and actually time your paddling speed ? Shadwell to Greenwich Pier is ~4.8 km, Temple Steps ~4.9 km.

    Hope that helps!
    Tony
     

     


  •  Wed, Jun 18 2008, 11:54 15409 in reply to 15353

    Re: Shadwell to Gravesend "zero logistics" trip (June 28th): The Master Plan

    Tony

    I went out with the slow group last night and did return trip to Greenwich Pier (I think - we were just before the Naval college and there was a pier) in 1.5 hours without footrests and was no-where near full pelt. I also have a tendancy not to want to stop for breaks so I shall pop myself in the morning group unless anyone raises concerns about this.

    Sarah


    Love many, trust few and always paddle your own canoe
  •  Wed, Jun 18 2008, 11:54 15410 in reply to 15353

    Re: Shadwell to Gravesend "zero logistics" trip (June 28th): The Master Plan

    Tony

    I went out with the slow group last night and did return trip to Greenwich Pier (I think - we were just before the Naval college and there was a pier) in 1.5 hours without footrests and was no-where near full pelt. I also have a tendancy not to want to stop for breaks so I shall pop myself in the morning group unless anyone raises concerns about this.

    Sarah


    Love many, trust few and always paddle your own canoe
  •  Thu, Jun 19 2008, 1:03 15414 in reply to 15318

    Shadwell to Gravesend - FINAL CALL

    Folks,

    If you want to take part in this trip, please post to this thread or let me know personally ASAP.

    We need to have the list finalised by this weekend (21st), leaving time left for people to try out boats on Tuesday night, book the kit needed, and for the dust to settle on final arrangements. If you haven't posted or contacted me, you aren't booked in.

    We currently have 10 names listed - which is fine - but there are currently too many people bidding for the AM slot. If this doesn't sort itself out by the weekend, I may be looking for volunteers to change shift.

    Cheers
    Tony 

  •  Thu, Jun 19 2008, 4:09 15421 in reply to 15414

    Re: Shadwell to Gravesend - FINAL CALL

    I need to be in the AM slot as I have evening arrangements.

    I would be happy to have someone drive my car to Gravesend so that I can bring boats back (with J bars, we can take 3).

  •  Thu, Jun 19 2008, 8:46 15424 in reply to 15421

    Re: Shadwell to Gravesend - FINAL CALL

    I'd like to book in for the return journey
  •  Thu, Jun 19 2008, 8:47 15425 in reply to 15424

    Re: Shadwell to Gravesend - FINAL CALL

    and i'll have whatever boat Sean paddles out in.
  •  Thu, Jun 19 2008, 16:26 15428 in reply to 15425

    Shadwell to Gravesend - TRIAL FIT

    Folks,

    Still a day or so left for more entrants - but on the basis of what we know so far, here's a partial solution:

     

    AM                     PM                     BOAT
    Chris (AM leader)      Chris                  OB (Folder)
    MikeOR                 Ailien (PM Leader)     OB (DaveT's Orion)
    Sean                   Liz                    Nordkapp
    TonyR                  JonEeles               OB (Tony's Viking)
    

    ...which is OK as far as it goes, but leaves these people unallocated:

     

    Charlie (AM leader)    AM                   .             
    Dan                    AM Preferred         Basin Romany  
    Sarah                  AM Preferred         Basin Explorer
    Pete                   AM Preferred         .             
    

    Dan/Sarah - you obviously want to paddle together.
    Any chance of you switching to PM ? How important is the AM slot to you ?

    The alternative is for both myself and Pete to switch to PM (a disappointment for me as a regular "fast group" paddler)

    Suggestions welcomed...

    TonyR

  •  Fri, Jun 20 2008, 1:44 15429 in reply to 15428

    Re: Shadwell to Gravesend - TRIAL FIT

    I'd like to join you and happy with the PM run. Im a 2* but confident on the thames and pretty sure my fitness levels are up to it.

    Any boat

    I'll be there on Tuesday

  •  Fri, Jun 20 2008, 7:47 15433 in reply to 15428

    Re: Shadwell to Gravesend - TRIAL FIT

    Dan and I can swap to afternoon.

    Sean, if you are still looking for someone to drive your car to Gravesend I could do this although I appreciate that you may not want just anyone to drive your car so no problems if I'm not on the responsible drivers list.

     

     


    Love many, trust few and always paddle your own canoe
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